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	<title>Comments for The Pedestrian 08 Campaign</title>
	<atom:link href="http://pedestrian08.org/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://pedestrian08.org</link>
	<description>Responsible drinking ends at 08</description>
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		<title>Comment on About the Pedestrian 08 Campaign by pedestrian08</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/01/supporters-page/#comment-6253</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[pedestrian08]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jan 2012 04:39:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=416#comment-6253</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for your comment mandate,
Let me respond this way:
I&#039;m sorry, but you might as well be in favor of prohibition.
&gt;&gt; No one is suggesting a return to prohibition.

There&#039;s a line when you can reasonably enforce certain regulations on alcohol and still put responsibility and choice into the hands of people who consume it. Laws like this would cross it.
&gt;&gt; Not sure what your construct of &quot;a line&quot; means. Perhaps it is a point of your acceptance? In any case, The Pedestrian 08 proposal is based on the success we have had here with our Motorists Point 05 law, which combined an easily understood BAC point 05 upper limit, an extensive and ongoing education campaign, reinforced via a judicious use of Random Breath Testing. 
&gt;&gt; Your reference to &quot;responsibility and choice&quot; ignores the devastating role Big Liquor advertising and sporting sponsorships have played in bringing up the total consumption of toxic, carcinogenic and addictive alcohol. To get a handle on how &quot;responsibility and choice&quot; is altered by Big Liquor&#039;s very clever and comprehensive, cradle to grave marketing campaign, review this research from the British Medical Association: &lt;a href=&quot;http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/03/an-evil-face-fevola-and-the-british-medical-association/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/03/an-evil-face-fevola-and-the-british-medical-association/&lt;/a&gt;

And if you have to resort to emotional manipulation by claiming policing people&#039;s alcohol usage is vital to protecting yourself or &quot;someone you love&quot;, then you don&#039;t have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period.
&gt;&gt; Puzzling line this. So, if you are worried about someone you love being or been killed or forever injured or traumatised by an act of alcohol fueled violence, be it via a fist, kick or car, then you don&#039;t &quot;have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period&quot;?  This is kind of a weird construct IMHO. 

Alcohol is a terrible and destructive substance, but it will never vanish from this earth. 
&gt;&gt; Mandate, the idea is to minimise the total annual intake and specifically to minimise binge drinking - especially binge drinking that occurs in contact with the public. 
In my state the forecast total annual intake of carcinogenic ethanol/alcohol is set to rise by another 0.5 litre per person per year. 
This will have terrible consequences for so many - including the unborn - as 1 in a 100 who will suffer FASD. 
Minimising marketing and using a drink walking limit as a vehicle for education and limitation of intake is just commonsense. 

People will find a way to use it and abuse it until the end of humanity. 
&gt;&gt; Yes, but, our society is on the way to eliminating tobacco use. So, no need to get negative on this terrible drug of addiction. Alcohol can be beaten. All the needed policies are known.
 
People will always die from alcohol poisoning, people will jump off bridges, commit suicide, beat their children, and there are people who will get drunk at an office party and wake up hungover the next morning and that will be the end of it.
&gt;&gt; The role of sensible policy and legislation work is to minimise the above. And all of the above can be minimised. 

People from all walks of life are different, and alcohol affects people&#039;s lives in different ways. Instead of dictating everyone else&#039;s freedom based on someone else&#039;s abuse of it, try targeting those who abuse it,
&gt;&gt; If your &quot;choice&quot; or the choice of someone you know is to endanger the lives of others via binge drinking, beyond a safe, pedestrian BAC Limit, then your behaviour, or that of the culprit, needs to be identified and targeted. 

either by supporting groups like AA or local church organizations. 
&gt;&gt; AA needs to be funded beyond it&#039;s limits by the those making money out of the misery of others. Eg, Big Liquor, their acolytes and the governments who support them. 

Instead of pouring money into smear campaigns in local television, donate to organizations like Children of Alcoholics. Put your money, time, and effort towards a constructive cause. Nobody&#039;s going to listen to you otherwise.
&gt;&gt; From little things, big things grow Mandate! The motorist 05 campaign took 20 years or so to garner support. 

&gt;&gt; Thanks again for your contribution.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your comment mandate,<br />
Let me respond this way:<br />
I&#8217;m sorry, but you might as well be in favor of prohibition.<br />
&gt;&gt; No one is suggesting a return to prohibition.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s a line when you can reasonably enforce certain regulations on alcohol and still put responsibility and choice into the hands of people who consume it. Laws like this would cross it.<br />
&gt;&gt; Not sure what your construct of &#8220;a line&#8221; means. Perhaps it is a point of your acceptance? In any case, The Pedestrian 08 proposal is based on the success we have had here with our Motorists Point 05 law, which combined an easily understood BAC point 05 upper limit, an extensive and ongoing education campaign, reinforced via a judicious use of Random Breath Testing.<br />
&gt;&gt; Your reference to &#8220;responsibility and choice&#8221; ignores the devastating role Big Liquor advertising and sporting sponsorships have played in bringing up the total consumption of toxic, carcinogenic and addictive alcohol. To get a handle on how &#8220;responsibility and choice&#8221; is altered by Big Liquor&#8217;s very clever and comprehensive, cradle to grave marketing campaign, review this research from the British Medical Association: <a href="http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/03/an-evil-face-fevola-and-the-british-medical-association/" rel="nofollow">http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/03/an-evil-face-fevola-and-the-british-medical-association/</a></p>
<p>And if you have to resort to emotional manipulation by claiming policing people&#8217;s alcohol usage is vital to protecting yourself or &#8220;someone you love&#8221;, then you don&#8217;t have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period.<br />
&gt;&gt; Puzzling line this. So, if you are worried about someone you love being or been killed or forever injured or traumatised by an act of alcohol fueled violence, be it via a fist, kick or car, then you don&#8217;t &#8220;have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period&#8221;?  This is kind of a weird construct IMHO. </p>
<p>Alcohol is a terrible and destructive substance, but it will never vanish from this earth.<br />
&gt;&gt; Mandate, the idea is to minimise the total annual intake and specifically to minimise binge drinking &#8211; especially binge drinking that occurs in contact with the public.<br />
In my state the forecast total annual intake of carcinogenic ethanol/alcohol is set to rise by another 0.5 litre per person per year.<br />
This will have terrible consequences for so many &#8211; including the unborn &#8211; as 1 in a 100 who will suffer FASD.<br />
Minimising marketing and using a drink walking limit as a vehicle for education and limitation of intake is just commonsense. </p>
<p>People will find a way to use it and abuse it until the end of humanity.<br />
&gt;&gt; Yes, but, our society is on the way to eliminating tobacco use. So, no need to get negative on this terrible drug of addiction. Alcohol can be beaten. All the needed policies are known.</p>
<p>People will always die from alcohol poisoning, people will jump off bridges, commit suicide, beat their children, and there are people who will get drunk at an office party and wake up hungover the next morning and that will be the end of it.<br />
&gt;&gt; The role of sensible policy and legislation work is to minimise the above. And all of the above can be minimised. </p>
<p>People from all walks of life are different, and alcohol affects people&#8217;s lives in different ways. Instead of dictating everyone else&#8217;s freedom based on someone else&#8217;s abuse of it, try targeting those who abuse it,<br />
&gt;&gt; If your &#8220;choice&#8221; or the choice of someone you know is to endanger the lives of others via binge drinking, beyond a safe, pedestrian BAC Limit, then your behaviour, or that of the culprit, needs to be identified and targeted. </p>
<p>either by supporting groups like AA or local church organizations.<br />
&gt;&gt; AA needs to be funded beyond it&#8217;s limits by the those making money out of the misery of others. Eg, Big Liquor, their acolytes and the governments who support them. </p>
<p>Instead of pouring money into smear campaigns in local television, donate to organizations like Children of Alcoholics. Put your money, time, and effort towards a constructive cause. Nobody&#8217;s going to listen to you otherwise.<br />
&gt;&gt; From little things, big things grow Mandate! The motorist 05 campaign took 20 years or so to garner support. </p>
<p>&gt;&gt; Thanks again for your contribution.</p>
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		<title>Comment on About the Pedestrian 08 Campaign by mandatefromthepeople</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2009/10/01/supporters-page/#comment-6248</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mandatefromthepeople]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Jan 2012 00:54:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=416#comment-6248</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m sorry, but you might as well be in favor of prohibition.

There&#039;s a line when you can reasonably enforce certain regulations on alcohol and still put responsibility and choice into the hands of people who consume it. Laws like this would cross it.

And if you have to resort to emotional manipulation by claiming policing people&#039;s alcohol usage is vital to protecting yourself or &quot;someone you love&quot;, then you don&#039;t have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period.

Alcohol is a terrible and destructive substance, but it will never vanish from this earth. People will find a way to use it and abuse it until the end of humanity. People will always die from alcohol poisoning, people will jump off bridges, commit suicide, beat their children, and there are people who will get drunk at an office party and wake up hungover the next morning and that will be the end of it.

People from all walks of life are different, and alcohol affects people&#039;s lives in different ways. Instead of dictating everyone else&#039;s freedom based on someone else&#039;s abuse of it, try targeting those who abuse it, either by supporting groups like AA or local church organizations. Instead of pouring money into smear campaigns in local television, donate to organizations like Children of Alcoholics. Put your money, time, and effort towards a constructive cause. Nobody&#039;s going to listen to you otherwise.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry, but you might as well be in favor of prohibition.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s a line when you can reasonably enforce certain regulations on alcohol and still put responsibility and choice into the hands of people who consume it. Laws like this would cross it.</p>
<p>And if you have to resort to emotional manipulation by claiming policing people&#8217;s alcohol usage is vital to protecting yourself or &#8220;someone you love&#8221;, then you don&#8217;t have a legitimate case for any state passing laws like this, period.</p>
<p>Alcohol is a terrible and destructive substance, but it will never vanish from this earth. People will find a way to use it and abuse it until the end of humanity. People will always die from alcohol poisoning, people will jump off bridges, commit suicide, beat their children, and there are people who will get drunk at an office party and wake up hungover the next morning and that will be the end of it.</p>
<p>People from all walks of life are different, and alcohol affects people&#8217;s lives in different ways. Instead of dictating everyone else&#8217;s freedom based on someone else&#8217;s abuse of it, try targeting those who abuse it, either by supporting groups like AA or local church organizations. Instead of pouring money into smear campaigns in local television, donate to organizations like Children of Alcoholics. Put your money, time, and effort towards a constructive cause. Nobody&#8217;s going to listen to you otherwise.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Reaching for responsibility &#8211; are we there yet? by Photobooth Journal</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2011/10/17/reaching-for-responsibility-are-we-there-yet/#comment-5687</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Photobooth Journal]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Nov 2011 05:31:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=968#comment-5687</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Good one Mike! Keep it up 10,000 visitors is a brilliant number.  The message will sink in one day.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good one Mike! Keep it up 10,000 visitors is a brilliant number.  The message will sink in one day.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Contact Page by Tracey Hurlbut</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/what-can-i-do/#comment-2624</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tracey Hurlbut]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Mar 2011 04:04:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.wordpress.com/?page_id=9#comment-2624</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well done Mike, I think what you are doing is fantastic i would vote for you any day.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well done Mike, I think what you are doing is fantastic i would vote for you any day.</p>
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		<title>Comment on ABC 891 (South Australia) radio interview uploaded by jeffg</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2010/11/18/abc-891-south-australia-radio-interview-uploaded/#comment-2401</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jeffg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Jan 2011 19:01:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=812#comment-2401</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[will there be a blog post on how you feel your campaign went? i&#039;d like to know what you learned from being involved in the election and if you stand at the next election. what were the highs and lows?

i&#039;ve listened to the interview a few times. i have some comments on it that i&#039;d like to pass on. it will take me a while to get them down. please let me know if you&#039;d like them posted here, or elsewhere.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>will there be a blog post on how you feel your campaign went? i&#8217;d like to know what you learned from being involved in the election and if you stand at the next election. what were the highs and lows?</p>
<p>i&#8217;ve listened to the interview a few times. i have some comments on it that i&#8217;d like to pass on. it will take me a while to get them down. please let me know if you&#8217;d like them posted here, or elsewhere.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Contact Page by Alex</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/what-can-i-do/#comment-2086</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Alex]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Nov 2010 10:54:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.wordpress.com/?page_id=9#comment-2086</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Mike,

Met you today at that Brighton polling booth. Only 5 comments here and so foulmouthed!  These people don&#039;t even take the time to read and understand your good intentions.   Please don&#039;t be discouraged: Rome wasn&#039;t built in a day and there are always fools among the bricklayers.

 Very disappointed to see that the ABC here: http://www.abc.net.au/elections/vic/2010/guide/brig.htm not only doesn&#039;t even mention you by name, but indicates that you got a swing against yourself! As a first time candidate and all, that&#039;s pretty hard to beat...:-)  Of course, it doesn&#039;t really mean that, it&#039;s just that the previous independent candidate might have got more votes than you, and I have no idea what their plank was.  Maybe they had a bigger crowd of supporters. Also, some of those who usually voted Lib might have supported the previous independent on first prefs, but this time people are so annoyed with Labour, even Brighton has a 10%+ swing to the Libs.

Best wishes for the future, and your campaign ( which should not stop.... now comes the approaches to new Government Ministers, for ex.) and also for the Festive Season!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mike,</p>
<p>Met you today at that Brighton polling booth. Only 5 comments here and so foulmouthed!  These people don&#8217;t even take the time to read and understand your good intentions.   Please don&#8217;t be discouraged: Rome wasn&#8217;t built in a day and there are always fools among the bricklayers.</p>
<p> Very disappointed to see that the ABC here: <a href="http://www.abc.net.au/elections/vic/2010/guide/brig.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.abc.net.au/elections/vic/2010/guide/brig.htm</a> not only doesn&#8217;t even mention you by name, but indicates that you got a swing against yourself! As a first time candidate and all, that&#8217;s pretty hard to beat&#8230;:-)  Of course, it doesn&#8217;t really mean that, it&#8217;s just that the previous independent candidate might have got more votes than you, and I have no idea what their plank was.  Maybe they had a bigger crowd of supporters. Also, some of those who usually voted Lib might have supported the previous independent on first prefs, but this time people are so annoyed with Labour, even Brighton has a 10%+ swing to the Libs.</p>
<p>Best wishes for the future, and your campaign ( which should not stop&#8230;. now comes the approaches to new Government Ministers, for ex.) and also for the Festive Season!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Press Release &#8211; Mike Cockburn Election Press Release No.2 &#8211; L I B campaign launch overshadowed by pedestrian08</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2010/11/18/press-release-mike-cockburn-election-press-release-no-2-l-i-b-campaign-launch-overshadowed/#comment-2068</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[pedestrian08]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Nov 2010 09:58:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=807#comment-2068</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for your input Eric.
Your questions have been answered elsewhere on this site.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your input Eric.<br />
Your questions have been answered elsewhere on this site.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Press Release &#8211; Mike Cockburn Election Press Release No.2 &#8211; L I B campaign launch overshadowed by Eric Glare</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2010/11/18/press-release-mike-cockburn-election-press-release-no-2-l-i-b-campaign-launch-overshadowed/#comment-2066</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Eric Glare]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Nov 2010 06:29:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=807#comment-2066</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mike, you should look up the fable of the Lepricorn&#039;s gold. Have you had any thought at all about the numbers of people you are targetting or are 99% of pedestrians over 0.08 going to go untested?

So next time your neigbours have a house party, remember that under your &#039;ideology&#039;, there will be 10 times the number of guests (too risky to go to a bar or a club) and they will have to stay all night (too risky to walk to a taxi). Do you have spare beds? They could climb the fence as its too risky on the footpath.
Or maybe they will just take $50 pills, preferrably one of the new ones no one knows anything about so they can be sure that they cannot be tested. Its a bright new Cockburn world.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike, you should look up the fable of the Lepricorn&#8217;s gold. Have you had any thought at all about the numbers of people you are targetting or are 99% of pedestrians over 0.08 going to go untested?</p>
<p>So next time your neigbours have a house party, remember that under your &#8216;ideology&#8217;, there will be 10 times the number of guests (too risky to go to a bar or a club) and they will have to stay all night (too risky to walk to a taxi). Do you have spare beds? They could climb the fence as its too risky on the footpath.<br />
Or maybe they will just take $50 pills, preferrably one of the new ones no one knows anything about so they can be sure that they cannot be tested. Its a bright new Cockburn world.</p>
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		<title>Comment on ABC 891 (South Australia) radio interview uploaded by jeffg</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2010/11/18/abc-891-south-australia-radio-interview-uploaded/#comment-2055</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jeffg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Nov 2010 16:35:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=812#comment-2055</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[thanks very much]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks very much</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>Comment on Policy Page Amended by Unjust</title>
		<link>http://pedestrian08.org/2010/11/10/policy-page-amended/#comment-2028</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Unjust]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Nov 2010 09:26:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pedestrian08.org/?p=780#comment-2028</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree we need action to curb the violence including what some alternatives that have been offered. The notion of a this proposed law has some merit and would be a great test of community judgement to ask for the Law Reform Commission or Sentencing Advisory Council to implement a public debate on the issue.  Before police arrest a person for Drunk in a public place to spend a minumum 4 hours in the cells for their safety or hospital for a period of time, they must weigh up criteria to determine that the person is drunk and warrants safe housing rather than an alternative avenue.  In general as you may have personally experienced or have knowledge that a person will only change their attitude or rehabilitate themselves if they really want to.  Victoria thanks to the Labor Gov&#039;t since mid 1990&#039;s have expressly pushed for rehabilitative measures that have not reduced crime.  This is why I agree that your notion is useful and I certainly agree we need tougher penalties associated with violence in general as our sentencing provisions are pathetic within our Magistrates Court and many offences within the County Court that do not correlate to the provision of an indefinte sentence applicable to both the Supreme and County Courts.  It is very difficult for anyone let alone the families, police to deal with any death or sometimes serious injury resulting from alcohol and/or drug fuelled violence.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree we need action to curb the violence including what some alternatives that have been offered. The notion of a this proposed law has some merit and would be a great test of community judgement to ask for the Law Reform Commission or Sentencing Advisory Council to implement a public debate on the issue.  Before police arrest a person for Drunk in a public place to spend a minumum 4 hours in the cells for their safety or hospital for a period of time, they must weigh up criteria to determine that the person is drunk and warrants safe housing rather than an alternative avenue.  In general as you may have personally experienced or have knowledge that a person will only change their attitude or rehabilitate themselves if they really want to.  Victoria thanks to the Labor Gov&#8217;t since mid 1990&#8242;s have expressly pushed for rehabilitative measures that have not reduced crime.  This is why I agree that your notion is useful and I certainly agree we need tougher penalties associated with violence in general as our sentencing provisions are pathetic within our Magistrates Court and many offences within the County Court that do not correlate to the provision of an indefinte sentence applicable to both the Supreme and County Courts.  It is very difficult for anyone let alone the families, police to deal with any death or sometimes serious injury resulting from alcohol and/or drug fuelled violence.</p>
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